Why doesn't REDuction have science readings to back it up?...

[Nitrosoxide]

I like how most of the CL Products include some scientific reading to back up the formulations of their product?

I'm considering REDuction... But, I have no clue about what the heck any of those ingredients are supposed to do, and why they'll cause fat loss.

It just seems like taking something blindly.

I love all the other products, but I'd like to get to understand the basis for the ingredients included in REDuction.

[Controlled Labs]

its all in the FAQ:

http://controlledlabsforum.com/showthread.php?t=7537

[jiritt0]

research them yourelf -- its the smart thng todo, you never know what some of the random copanies throw into stuff and sell

[Nitrosoxide]

Hmm... Well the whole Rasberry ketone thing seems to be true but only in rats.

I haven't found any research suggesting any implications that these molecules would help with human fat loss.

So I'm Skeptical

[jiritt0]

their in AMP2 -- I just ran a bottleof that and liked it... i got more info on it somewhere, but im busy tonight to get it out, ill post some otmorrow

[pu12en12g]

I'm Skeptical

Awesome, give the samples a try and go from there. REDuction uses potent and proven ingredients but it's really all about results and real world feedback.... in other words it isn't a miracle supplement and that's why the writeup might bore you. We don't make insane claims like many companies... and consumers really respect that in my experience.

[Sethva]

Awesome, give the samples a try and go from there. REDuction uses potent and proven ingredients but it's really all about results and real world feedback.... in other words it isn't a miracle supplement and that's why the writeup might bore you. We don't make insane claims like many companies... and consumers really respect that in my experience.

dont promise the world if you cant provide it.

[pu12en12g]

dont promise the world if you cant provide it.

Werd.... our consumers are in reality, a good place to be for long term results.

[jiritt0]

Werd.... our consumers are in reality, a good place to be for long term results.

t
the mind & body are only able of what the self dreams

[Nitrosoxide]

their in AMP2 -- I just ran a bottleof that and liked it... i got more info on it somewhere, but im busy tonight to get it out, ill post some otmorrow

Thanks I'd love to see some

[jiritt0]

http://controlledlabsforum.com/showt...=fruity+breath


general jist is in here...

[Nitrosoxide]

Ya I read about that...

on wikipedia it states

"When given to mice in high doses (up to 2% of food intake), raspberry ketone has been shown to prevent high-fat-diet-induced elevations in body weight.[4] This effect is reported to stem from the alteration of lipid metabolism, increasing norepinephrine-induced lipolysis. Although products containing this compound are marketed for weight loss, this effect has not been demonstrated in humans. "

So why would it work on humans?

[jiritt0]

why mice?
As mammals, mice are considered a good but imperfect surrogate for studies
of human diseases and conditions; their body plan, physiology and genome
share many features with our own. Traditional breeding methods have
resulted in the generation of many highly inbred lines of mice which have
been very useful in studies of the immune system as well as other areas.

http://www.madsci.org/posts/archives...8583.Gb.r.html



Raspberry Ketones (RK) add the finishing touch to DCP. RK is similar in structure to capsaicin and
synephrine, and also has been shown to modulate fat metabolism. RK stimulates the release of
norepinephrine (NE), a catecholamine with many functions. Most importantly to us is its role in the
sympathetic nervous system. NE, having a great affinity on beta and alpha-1 adrenoreceptors in the
body, activates lipolysis that normally only occurs during exercise or other intensive activity. This
results in an increase of free fatty acids which will be burned via methods described above (14).

14. Morimoto C, Satoh Y, Hara M, Inoue S, Tsujita T, Okuda H. Anti-obese action of raspberry ketone.
Life sciences 2005;77(2):194-204.

MORE
Anti-obese action of raspberry ketone

Chie Morimotoa, , , Yurie Satohb, 1, Mariko Harab, Shintaro Inoueb, c, 1, Takahiro Tsujitae and Hiromichi Okudad

aDepartment of Medical Biochemistry, Ehime University School of Medicine, Shigenobu-cho, Onsen-gun, Ehime 791-0295, Japan

Abstract
Raspberry ketone (4-(4-hydroxyphenyl) butan-2-one; RK) is a major aromatic compound of red raspberry (Rubus idaeus). The structure of RK is similar to the structures of capsaicin and synephrine, compounds known to exert anti-obese actions and alter the lipid metabolism. The present study was performed to clarify whether RK helps prevent obesity and activate lipid metabolism in rodents. To test the effect on obesity, our group designed the following in vivo experiments: 1) mice were fed a high-fat diet including 0.5, 1, or 2% of RK for 10 weeks; 2) mice were given a high-fat diet for 6 weeks and subsequently fed the same high-fat diet containing1% RK for the next 5 weeks. RK prevented the high-fat-diet-induced elevations in body weight and the weights of the liver and visceral adipose tissues (epididymal, retroperitoneal, and mesenteric). RK also decreased these weights and hepatic triacylglycerol content after they had been increased by a high-fat diet. RK significantly increased norepinephrine-induced lipolysis associated with the translocation of hormone-sensitive lipase from the cytosol to lipid droplets in rat epididymal fat cells. In conclusion, RK prevents and improves obesity and fatty liver. These effects appear to stem from the action of RK in altering the lipid metabolism, or more specifically, in increasing norepinephrine-induced lipolysis in white adipocytes.





Effect of topical application of raspberry ketone on dermal production of insulin-like growth factor-I in mice and on hair growth and skin elasticity in humans

Naoaki Haradaa, Kenji Okajimaa, , , Noriko Narimatsua, Hiroki Kuriharab and Naomi Nakagatac

aDepartment of Translational Medical Science Research, Nagoya City University Graduate School of Medical Sciences, Kawasumi 1, Mizuho-cho, Mizuho-ku, Nagoya 467-8601, Japan

Abstract
Sensory neurons release calcitonin gene-related peptide (CGRP) on activation. We recently reported that topical application of capsaicin increases facial skin elasticity and promotes hair growth by increasing dermal insulin-like growth factor-I (IGF-I) production through activation of sensory neurons in mice and humans. Raspberry ketone (RK), a major aromatic compound contained in red raspberries (Rubus idaeus), has a structure similar to that of capsaicin. Thus, it is possible that RK activates sensory neurons, thereby increasing skin elasticity and promoting hair growth by increasing dermal IGF-I production. In the present study, we examined this possibility in mice and humans. RK, at concentrations higher than 1 μM, significantly increased CGRP release from dorsal root ganglion neurons (DRG) isolated from wild-type (WT) mice and this increase was completely reversed by capsazepine, an inhibitor of vanilloid receptor-1 activation. Topical application of 0.01% RK increased dermal IGF-I levels at 30 min after application in WT mice, but not in CGRP-knockout mice. Topical application of 0.01% RK increased immunohistochemical expression of IGF-I at dermal papillae in hair follicles and promoted hair re-growth in WT mice at 4 weeks after the application. When applied topically to the scalp and facial skin, 0.01% RK promoted hair growth in 50.0% of humans with alopecia (n = 10) at 5 months after application and increased cheek skin elasticity at 2 weeks after application in 5 females (p < 0.04). These observations strongly suggest that RK might increase dermal IGF-I production through sensory neuron activation, thereby promoting hair growth and increasing skin elasticity












-- second one is less relevant, but it seems rasberry ketones are replacing the pepper extract in terms of fat loss.. I wonder what happens when you combine both in a product?! I personally eat lots of peppers and a fair amount of rasberries.. both great health foods, and good for fat loss.

Tomorrow I am beginning reduction myself after a 2-3 week layoff of stims/fat burners (AMP2 last)...

[Controlled Labs]

why mice?
As mammals, mice are considered a good but imperfect surrogate for studies
of human diseases and conditions; their body plan, physiology and genome
share many features with our own. Traditional breeding methods have
resulted in the generation of many highly inbred lines of mice which have
been very useful in studies of the immune system as well as other areas.

http://www.madsci.org/posts/archives...8583.Gb.r.html



Raspberry Ketones (RK) add the finishing touch to DCP. RK is similar in structure to capsaicin and
synephrine, and also has been shown to modulate fat metabolism. RK stimulates the release of
norepinephrine (NE), a catecholamine with many functions. Most importantly to us is its role in the
sympathetic nervous system. NE, having a great affinity on beta and alpha-1 adrenoreceptors in the
body, activates lipolysis that normally only occurs during exercise or other intensive activity. This
results in an increase of free fatty acids which will be burned via methods described above (14).

14. Morimoto C, Satoh Y, Hara M, Inoue S, Tsujita T, Okuda H. Anti-obese action of raspberry ketone.
Life sciences 2005;77(2):194-204.

MORE
Anti-obese action of raspberry ketone

Chie Morimotoa, , , Yurie Satohb, 1, Mariko Harab, Shintaro Inoueb, c, 1, Takahiro Tsujitae and Hiromichi Okudad

aDepartment of Medical Biochemistry, Ehime University School of Medicine, Shigenobu-cho, Onsen-gun, Ehime 791-0295, Japan

Abstract
Raspberry ketone (4-(4-hydroxyphenyl) butan-2-one; RK) is a major aromatic compound of red raspberry (Rubus idaeus). The structure of RK is similar to the structures of capsaicin and synephrine, compounds known to exert anti-obese actions and alter the lipid metabolism. The present study was performed to clarify whether RK helps prevent obesity and activate lipid metabolism in rodents. To test the effect on obesity, our group designed the following in vivo experiments: 1) mice were fed a high-fat diet including 0.5, 1, or 2% of RK for 10 weeks; 2) mice were given a high-fat diet for 6 weeks and subsequently fed the same high-fat diet containing1% RK for the next 5 weeks. RK prevented the high-fat-diet-induced elevations in body weight and the weights of the liver and visceral adipose tissues (epididymal, retroperitoneal, and mesenteric). RK also decreased these weights and hepatic triacylglycerol content after they had been increased by a high-fat diet. RK significantly increased norepinephrine-induced lipolysis associated with the translocation of hormone-sensitive lipase from the cytosol to lipid droplets in rat epididymal fat cells. In conclusion, RK prevents and improves obesity and fatty liver. These effects appear to stem from the action of RK in altering the lipid metabolism, or more specifically, in increasing norepinephrine-induced lipolysis in white adipocytes.





Effect of topical application of raspberry ketone on dermal production of insulin-like growth factor-I in mice and on hair growth and skin elasticity in humans

Naoaki Haradaa, Kenji Okajimaa, , , Noriko Narimatsua, Hiroki Kuriharab and Naomi Nakagatac

aDepartment of Translational Medical Science Research, Nagoya City University Graduate School of Medical Sciences, Kawasumi 1, Mizuho-cho, Mizuho-ku, Nagoya 467-8601, Japan

Abstract
Sensory neurons release calcitonin gene-related peptide (CGRP) on activation. We recently reported that topical application of capsaicin increases facial skin elasticity and promotes hair growth by increasing dermal insulin-like growth factor-I (IGF-I) production through activation of sensory neurons in mice and humans. Raspberry ketone (RK), a major aromatic compound contained in red raspberries (Rubus idaeus), has a structure similar to that of capsaicin. Thus, it is possible that RK activates sensory neurons, thereby increasing skin elasticity and promoting hair growth by increasing dermal IGF-I production. In the present study, we examined this possibility in mice and humans. RK, at concentrations higher than 1 μM, significantly increased CGRP release from dorsal root ganglion neurons (DRG) isolated from wild-type (WT) mice and this increase was completely reversed by capsazepine, an inhibitor of vanilloid receptor-1 activation. Topical application of 0.01% RK increased dermal IGF-I levels at 30 min after application in WT mice, but not in CGRP-knockout mice. Topical application of 0.01% RK increased immunohistochemical expression of IGF-I at dermal papillae in hair follicles and promoted hair re-growth in WT mice at 4 weeks after the application. When applied topically to the scalp and facial skin, 0.01% RK promoted hair growth in 50.0% of humans with alopecia (n = 10) at 5 months after application and increased cheek skin elasticity at 2 weeks after application in 5 females (p < 0.04). These observations strongly suggest that RK might increase dermal IGF-I production through sensory neuron activation, thereby promoting hair growth and increasing skin elasticity












-- second one is less relevant, but it seems rasberry ketones are replacing the pepper extract in terms of fat loss.. I wonder what happens when you combine both in a product?! I personally eat lots of peppers and a fair amount of rasberries.. both great health foods, and good for fat loss.

Tomorrow I am beginning reduction myself after a 2-3 week layoff of stims/fat burners (AMP2 last)...

REDuction has both

[jiritt0]

nice -- i took 1 cap last night, but my sleep was messedup (up til 1am watching a movie, woke up at 6:55am to call my bank as soon as they opened) -- i ended up laying in bed til 930 and didnt want to leave at all. haha



question about REDuction -- would it be okay to combine that with USPlabs CAMPhibolic?

http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/usp/camp.html

130 Capsules
Supplement Facts
Serving Size2Capsules
Servings Per Container65

Amount Per Serving

SynergyBlend™ 1140mg *
Green Tea (95% Polyphenol 50% EGCG) *
Mucuna Pruriens *
Bacopa Minnieri (40% Bacosides) *
Forslean™ *

* Daily Value not established

Other Ingredients
Gelatin, Cellulose



I have like 1/4 bottle of it left, and just saw its on sale at bb.com... might pick up more if its stackable