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  • #31
    Originally posted by jzepp View Post
    Actually from my own experience and from alot of research, you are better off getting your arms bigger by concentrating on developing a bigger back and chest. Your biceps will grow from mostly heavy compound back exercises like pullups, chins and bentover rows and your triceps will grow from alot of benching and dips.

    You really dont need alot of arm exercises for the arms to grow....just concentrate on getting the big compound exercises up in weight. Also, gaining alot of bodyweight will put size on your arms.
    Exactly, I stopped workin on my arms months ago. Unless you want to be a bodybuilder or a wanna be bigshot, youre better off not isolating em
    "Greater love hath no man, than to lay down his life for a friend" John 15:13
    CFD

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    • #32
      Originally posted by jzepp View Post
      Actually from my own experience and from alot of research, you are better off getting your arms bigger by concentrating on developing a bigger back and chest. Your biceps will grow from mostly heavy compound back exercises like pullups, chins and bentover rows and your triceps will grow from alot of benching and dips.

      You really dont need alot of arm exercises for the arms to grow....just concentrate on getting the big compound exercises up in weight. Also, gaining alot of bodyweight will put size on your arms.



      A+

      Whenever someone inquires about my bench or other dumb meathead display of strength, I typically don't answer and ask their back squat or overhead squat max


      I'm getting close to oly squats with my bodyweight; that will be a good day

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      • #33
        What are you squatting JD?

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        • #34
          yesterday back squatted 325 for a double with ease..
          and a week or two ago I was pretty happy I back squatted 315 onto a box below parallell

          my max test at the end of last year was just under 400 with back squat - I am aiming for 500+ by the end of this year


          I don't wear belts, and hit parallel (or deeper) to stay north of vag. I use powerlifting movements (plus shoulder press/rows) after olympic lifts and/or plyometrics, so I am almost never fresh when I train them.

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          • #35
            Why dont you wear a belt on squats and why are your powerlifitng movements after you plyos and olym lifts?
            "Greater love hath no man, than to lay down his life for a friend" John 15:13
            CFD

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            • #36
              Originally posted by jdiritto View Post
              yesterday back squatted 325 for a double with ease..
              and a week or two ago I was pretty happy I back squatted 315 onto a box below parallell

              my max test at the end of last year was just under 400 with back squat - I am aiming for 500+ by the end of this year


              I don't wear belts, and hit parallel (or deeper) to stay north of vag. I use powerlifting movements (plus shoulder press/rows) after olympic lifts and/or plyometrics, so I am almost never fresh when I train them.
              Not toooo shabby

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              • #37
                belts are for () I say. I like to use my core musculature as a natural belt.. plus I train athletes, have oyu ever seen a football player wearing a belt on 3rd and long? or a 400m sprinter wearing a belt during nationals? You think Lebron James wears a belt during bball games?

                No, belts/wraps/chalk is all a crutch for training in my mind. I've recently found I can't even squat with a belt on; I was trying max effort doubles a few weeks back and threw one on thinking it would be a good idea per safety reasons, but than I found I couldnt brace my abdominals correctly and just felt awkward so I took it off and banged out the reps natural..

                my back used to hurt more from lifting lighter weights while wearing a belt than it does now from lifting heavy weight with no belt -- this cant be attributed solely to my use (or lack thereof) of weight belts, as I have made significant dietary consumption changes and really developed an ideal program design (compared to my shitty outdated bodybuilding ways in the past)

                belts do have their place on max effort squats/deads, but I am talking about 3rep maxes or lower, and that is it!! any other use of a belt simply neglects core musculature that needs to be developed through compound lifts and the natural core bracing demands that accompany them.

                There are great articles on the debate of belts I could try and find for you if interested; I forget who wrote the one bashing belts all together, and than Dr. Mel Siff wrote a great response indictating the more realistic use of belts (most of what I have written here is a basic summary of those articles; which has been translated and refined in my head)



                I use powelrifting movements after olympic lifts/plyometrics because this is what science/my personal experience dictates.

                oly lifting/plyos are explosive in nature and are utilized for many reasons, mainly to increase the rate of force development (power) -- this is very taxing on the central nervous system and will fatique the body/involved musculature very quickly. this training also require a huge amount of neuromuscular coordination and control.

                Performing either in an already fatiqued state is a shortcut to injury or at the very least limited performance during said movements which will thus correlate with limited progressive gains. hence why oly lifts/plyos always come first -- than any ME/DE effort compound lifts

                My personal goals are to increase power (higher vertical jump, decrease 40yd dash time, lift more weight on every single lift due an increased ROFD), then develop maximal strength, muscular size, and endurance. This is why I also use a modified version of the russian conjugate sequence system; something that will be further optimized once I obtain the ability to train more consistently in the same facility with a power rack - it pisses me/I am shocked Temple athletics has zero power racks in the olympic sports training center!



                and yes; my lifts are shabby breathemetal..I can hardly olympic lift my bodyweight, which pisses me off to no end. While I do sacrifice #s in the name of textbook technique, that is no excuse for weakness. How am I to coach people to be the best they can (especially in strength/power avenues) if I can not even lift two wet socks myself. I do not strive to be a textbook coach, I want to be an in the trenches meathead with scars to prove it, while also commanding a somewhat decent knowledge of textbook smarts. I educate myself to be the best coach I can, and I train to be better than everyone else. I will not be happy until I accomplish great things in both avenues; my coaching and my training.

                I have many times considered getting into competitive olympic lifting or powerlifting; but I do not feel either is a good avenue for me as I train like I coach; to be an athlete. Neither olympic lifters or powerlifters (or bodybuilders) are athletes in my mind. I believe athletics demands an internal neural reaction-response coupling due to an external stimulus that is rapidly changing. (ie a football DB must internally modify and alter everything based on the external stimuli from the matched up WR or oppoenent before, during, and after a play for the duration of a competitive bout) -- this does not occur in the previously mentioned activities; they simply train to be in the best shape they can with regards to to their movement requirements, perform by themselves (or 99% naked, oiled up, with a fake tan on stage with opponents of the same sex), and are ranked upon their personal performance with no response/reaction required to opponents... this is just my view point on all that, which is somewhat off topic, but that is how i roll, ADD.
                Last edited by jiritt0; 03-18-2010, 08:02 AM.

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                • #38
                  I agree with you about belts. Yes they do have their place but man I see way to many guys in the gym misuse them. And Im not only talking about during squats and deads but even bench press! Its ridiculous. And Im suprised your training center doesnt have power racks. I know there was a recent article on elitefts that talks about the direction many gyms are going. Fitness itself has gotten..lazy so to speak. For instance in my gym, plenty of elliptical machines, weight machines, and free weights. Any pylo boxes, sand bags, hame glute benches, sleds or prowlers? Of course not. Im not saying you need to be stocked up like a college football fitness center but most gyms dont offer hardly any type of equipment that improves speed, agility, power. Now dont get me wrong; there are plenty of ways to use free weights to improve those attributes but when im trying to do squat jumps or push/pull barbell press and the gym owner tells me that this(the gym) is an unsafe place to do those excercises, there is a problem.
                  "Greater love hath no man, than to lay down his life for a friend" John 15:13
                  CFD

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by jzepp View Post
                    Actually from my own experience and from alot of research, you are better off getting your arms bigger by concentrating on developing a bigger back and chest. Your biceps will grow from mostly heavy compound back exercises like pullups, chins and bentover rows and your triceps will grow from alot of benching and dips.

                    You really dont need alot of arm exercises for the arms to grow....just concentrate on getting the big compound exercises up in weight. Also, gaining alot of bodyweight will put size on your arms.
                    While not a bodybuilder I do care about proportion, symmetry etc... much like a bodybuilder would. I'm of the opinion that with the exception of close grip bench press and dips, any direct arm work such as curls, triceps extensions etc. should be with lighter weights and longer time under tension if they're going to be implemented. For the most part, the exercises that you
                    mention such as pullups, rows and various presses should 'cover' the heavier loads needed for growth. Again there is still room for isolation arm exercises though definitely secondary in terms of priority.

                    Originally posted by farmerson12 View Post
                    Exactly, I stopped workin on my arms months ago. Unless you want to be a bodybuilder or a wanna be bigshot, youre better off not isolating em
                    kane@controlledlabs.com
                    Sponsored Controlled Labs Athlete
                    Looks for the ads, coming soon!
                    www.controlledlabs.com
                    www.controlledlabsforum.com

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                    • #40
                      good call on repeitition efforts on arm isolation (or any isolation) -- main goal being to strengthen a weak muscle/muscle group so it can support the demands of more important compound movements (than you must find the new weak link and bring that up, and than the next, and so on and so on)

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                      • #41
                        good words

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                        • #42
                          Yes I stand corrected. Thank you
                          "Greater love hath no man, than to lay down his life for a friend" John 15:13
                          CFD

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                          • #43
                            Sweet *%$^&%^& !!!

                            Just did arms and back... pre-workout was

                            1 JR Whopper
                            1 Spicy Chicken Crisp

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                            • #44
                              i did various curls and extensions yesterday! i was so proud of myself, i even accomplished the magical pump within 3-4minutes of training.

                              I even banged out some sets of seated calf raises to get a little pump in there. the fun part was when I did ankle mobility work, had 3 people come up and ask what I was doing and why..haha

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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by timberwolf View Post
                                While not a bodybuilder I do care about proportion, symmetry etc... much like a bodybuilder would. I'm of the opinion that with the exception of close grip bench press and dips, any direct arm work such as curls, triceps extensions etc. should be with lighter weights and longer time under tension if they're going to be implemented. For the most part, the exercises that you
                                mention such as pullups, rows and various presses should 'cover' the heavier loads needed for growth. Again there is still room for isolation arm exercises though definitely secondary in terms of priority.

                                Kane..I still do arm exercises but i may do only 6 sets for biceps and triceps. I see people doing as many arm exercises as they do for chest, back, legs in which i feel is too much. As for your higher rep philosophy, why do you recommend this? I do 4-10 reps for biceps and triceps using mostly barbell curls, dumbbell curls, CGBP, lying tricep extensions and dips. Is that too low rep wise?

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